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Post by The Lions' Den on Jan 15, 2016 13:26:04 GMT 1
Post your match comments here..........
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Post by Auldnick on Jan 15, 2016 19:21:55 GMT 1
Much as it pains me to say it, I fear we are literally on a hiding to nothing 5-0 to the unwashed
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Pedro
Administrator
Posts: 1,172
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Post by Pedro on Jan 15, 2016 23:16:43 GMT 1
Avoiding a hiding would be acceptable.
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Post by colcal on Jan 15, 2016 23:38:22 GMT 1
I'll be there, despite the inevitable outcome. First penalty claim will be inside 5 minutes. First penalty award in the first half. I remember, some time ago, a Rangers fan calling a phone-in to complain that they'd had 8 penalty claims in a particular game but hadn't been given any of them - the idea presumably that if you claim often enough, you should surely be given at least one of them. Whether any merited a penalty was clearly irrelevant. That's par for the course and no doubt there'll be plenty of claims tomorrow. After all, the Old Firm don't have enough of an advantage already. Prediction for the final score? Them - several; Us - zero. Even so, looking forward to seeing how David Hopkin's team lines up and how they approach it. Come on Livi!
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Post by monkeysocks on Jan 16, 2016 16:58:25 GMT 1
Half time 4-0 down, just to be helpful I say sack the manager. That always seems to work, yes?
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Post by Auldnick on Jan 16, 2016 17:39:35 GMT 1
Buchanan pulled 1 back and the flow of goals every 10 mins appears to be over, White has also netted but was adjudged to have fouled the keeper so it was chalked off
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Post by Benedict Le Gauche on Jan 17, 2016 22:44:56 GMT 1
Have we improved since before John McGlynn was appointed?
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Post by jonsnow on Jan 18, 2016 19:53:07 GMT 1
Horrible first half, second half was much better after Mullen and Buchanan came on, I think Hopkin blundered playing White up front alone in the first half. We had no out ball and couldn't take the pressure off our defence.
Only good thing that happened on Saturday was the Alloa game being abandoned when it looked like they had closed the gap to one point on us, i'll take good fortune wherever I can get it. Mon the Ton on the rearranged game.
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Post by livilion on Jan 19, 2016 14:17:00 GMT 1
Have we improved since before John McGlynn was appointed? Have we improved since Bollan was shown the door? Been downhill since then.
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Post by jonsnow on Jan 19, 2016 14:36:11 GMT 1
Yep, finances have gone down the toilet since then too, every season the playing budget has been cut and the quality of player we can afford has suffered accordingly. Attendances are dropping, we're fighting relegation two seasons running, oh the joys of being a Livi fan.
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Post by orco on Jan 19, 2016 22:03:03 GMT 1
Have we improved since before John McGlynn was appointed? Have we improved since Bollan was shown the door? Been downhill since then. My thoughts exactly. That was a huge mistake.
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Post by LiviLion21 on Jan 19, 2016 22:22:34 GMT 1
If Bollan was such a good manager, surely he'd have done more than tread the lower end of the Scottish leagues in the years since leaving us?
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Post by orco on Jan 19, 2016 22:36:26 GMT 1
I don't think anyone would claim that Bollan was an outstanding manager but we had a settled team and had management continuity for two and a half seasons. IMO we have never had that since he was inexplicably sacked. It also cost the club thousands of ££s in employment tribunal fees. I think it was also the start of disagreement in the Boardroom leading to what seems like never ending court cases. And of course Hughes and Collins deserted at the earliest opportunity.
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Post by LiviLion21 on Jan 19, 2016 23:24:35 GMT 1
Hughes would have been mad to turn down the opportunity he got while at us. A shame too because if that hadn't come up, I think he'd have had us in a much better place than we ended up.
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Post by Auldnick on Jan 20, 2016 0:44:02 GMT 1
Dream on LL21 and I'll tell you this, if leaving us for Hartlepool at that time was a career move then we'd be as well shutting down now. One of my work mates is a monkey hanger & his description of Hartlepool under Hughes was tippy tappy across the back four until they lost possession & usually a goal; then they would repeat the process...they had no plan B. Sound familiar anyone? After the usual "bounce under a new manager" Hartlepool were almost relegated from the FL & Hughes was sacked.
The bravest move in Scottish football was ICT taking him on & he was fortunate enough to inherit a team that was still improving & managed to sneak a Cup win thanks to Falkirk's keeper handing them the winner on a plate.
If he had stayed with us we'd still be where we are because it has been a cost cutting exercise since he joined & IMO THAT was why he left us for the first job offer that came along.
As Orco says, under Bollan we had stability & despite the "official" reasons for him leaving, we had promising youngsters starting to break through.
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Post by orco on Jan 20, 2016 1:03:09 GMT 1
Hughes would have been mad to turn down the opportunity he got while at us. A shame too because if that hadn't come up, I think he'd have had us in a much better place than we ended up. I suspect we were only ever going to be a shop window for Hughes. Like Auldnick I think he inherited a decent team at ICT. Time will tell if he can maintain it.
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Post by jonsnow on Jan 20, 2016 2:44:14 GMT 1
Hughes was a shyster, unless he has good players that can play despite his bloody 'football philosophy' he's cream crackered. Got his percentage worth out of us with the sale of all our talented players, even when he was no longer here, as did the other shyster Collins. Dundee Utd have the same problem with that percentage of players from transfer fees with MacNamara, managers have an agenda to sell on as many players as they can get rid and you're left with the dross. Asking for trouble when you go down that road. And the problem with Hughes was he hasn't the ability to build a good team.
Bit of the Mourinho syndrome about Hughes, does fine for a few seasons and then struggles with the 3rd season when some transition period of players coming and going happens.
Anyway as has been said by Orco and Auldnick, our problems run deeper than managers, the instability of the club started with Bollan being sacked, that's when the cracks in the boardroom started appearing, in fighting, money problems, court cases, paying compensation to managers, fines, transfer embargo's, cost cutting in playing budgets which gives us the end product, poor quality football. It all had a knock on effect and ultimately hits attendances.
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Post by LiviLion21 on Jan 20, 2016 14:33:25 GMT 1
After the usual "bounce under a new manager" Hartlepool were almost relegated from the FL & Hughes was sacked. Hartlepool were on a 20 match winless run before Hughes came in and already looked odds on to be relegated. He won manager of the month there in his time - not bad for a side who couldn't buy a win previous to his arrival. They had all but started planning for life in the league below when he came in. He also took Falkirk into the Premier League and to a Scottish cup final before guiding Hibs into the Europa League at his first attempt - two sides who are now in the Championship... He then got Inverness in their first ever league cup final, won their first ever Scottish Cup, won both Scottish Manager of the Year awards and took Inverness into Europe for their first time ever. You're surely not going to tell me all of that has come from inheriting good teams? I'd have Hughes (and Collins) over Bollan and anyone we've had since all day long. On the other point, you could also argue that Bollan had us in the bottoms tiers of Scottish football with squads which were very obviously of Championship quality. The result of that was a team which was winning on a regular basis so in turn, people were more interested. It was never going to be such a walk in the park in the Championship and as we started to not win games every single week, folk naturally start losing interest so I'd argue that also had an impact on things (as well as the off field nonsense).
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Post by Auldnick on Jan 20, 2016 20:13:01 GMT 1
I did mention the new manager "bounce" did I not?....& yet he still almost took them down & got punted. If Hughes had still been at either Hibs or Falkirk they would have gone down long before they did, they didn't because they punted him. Terry Butcher got ICT to the League Cup semi & they had a favourable draw & a good side. He got us in to the rut of not being able to win at home which is still cursing us.
Totally agree with your last paragraph though. Bollan however got them gelled, winning regularly & confident. Then the cost cutting started & we lost Robbie & Rafa amongst others. Obviously the 2nd tier was going to be more difficult but that is when the whole club should have been pulling together rather than punting the reasonably successful manager for the false reason that was given. If Bollan failed to deliver a competitive team in the 2nd tier then that would have been justification for punting him; but they were doing ok. Then in came Haudit & Daudit & after winning the first home game we couldn't buy one until Haudit left.
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Post by LiviLion21 on Jan 21, 2016 14:29:58 GMT 1
Surely you're not suggesting John Hughes is to blame for us being poor at home 3 years after he's left...?
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Pedro
Administrator
Posts: 1,172
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Post by Pedro on Jan 21, 2016 15:03:08 GMT 1
I wouldn't know about that LL21 but his teams performance over at East End park when Dunfermline reamed us for 90 minutes will stay with me for a very, very long time.
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Post by Auldnick on Jan 21, 2016 21:53:05 GMT 1
Surely you're not suggesting John Hughes is to blame for us being poor at home 3 years after he's left...? Well it was their responsibility during their tenure and we haven't got out of the bind since. In all honesty I believe our rather large and mostly empty stadium with a decent playing surface is a problem. The opposition enjoy playing here because of the surface and we seem to crumble as the predominant atmosphere is one of hostility from sections of the home fans as soon as anything starts to go wrong. We all know how frustrating it is when we go behind but that is when the team needs the support to rally behind them. The opposition usually only have a small support with them so little atmosphere plays into their hands. Whenever the bigger sides come with their large support we tend to play better and our fans are largely supportive even in adversity because losing to the big clubs is largely expected. Which brings it back to expectations, unrealistic expectations lead to increased pressure.which leads to poor performances and results.
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Post by edinlivi on Jan 21, 2016 22:13:09 GMT 1
I wouldn't know about that LL21 but his teams performance over at East End park when Dunfermline reamed us for 90 minutes will stay with me for a very, very long time. This game instantly comes to mind when I think of the Hughes days. Probably the most inept performance I've ever seen from a Livingston team.
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Post by monkeysocks on Jan 21, 2016 23:17:26 GMT 1
I wouldn't know about that LL21 but his teams performance over at East End park when Dunfermline reamed us for 90 minutes will stay with me for a very, very long time. This game instantly comes to mind when I think of the Hughes days. Probably the most inept performance I've ever seen from a Livingston team. Was that the game Garcia Tena made his debut ( or maybe his second game for us ) and he was played at left back ? Lad had a nightmare , alongside others.
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